LMS Milk Tank - 2

[Keith1500]

Dave,

Thank you Dave... and sorry didn’t mention it above but thanks go to you too for the photos you provided of the Milk Tank wagons near you. They were particularly helpful with the AVB pipework and some of the brake bits.

I hope a few other people might post build notes and photos of their projects. Most of us have a digital camera now-a-days, the tricky bit I found was providing the link information so it connects to my Flickr site where they are stored.

Cheers
Keith

[Keith1500]

Having got over an awful cold. I have been making a box for the tank to travel in. The box is based on Martin R's design which I first used for the Toad and it worked quite well. I have seen other peoples boxes and i might try to get a series of photos together this year with a view to doing a brief artcle on them. Please feel free to contribute. I know we all have lots of good ideas that work well.

One thing I tried with this box was to reduce the weight. So the base and door are 12mm ply while the sides are 9mm ply. It certainly doesnt feel as strong as the others which are 12mm ply through out, but then I havent fully glued and screwed it together yet.



The general arrangement of the box.



With this design of Martin's the thing that stops the wagon rocking and touching the sides is the buffers being captured in "buffer-cups". Plus the buffers are slightly compressed when the door is closed, thereby capturing the wagon.

I need to go and visit my friendly engineering shop and have some more moulded in plastic, assuming he still has my injection moulding jig I made.

[Eddyg]

Keith,

I don't think you've got to the bottom of weight reduction on your box. My 3 1/2" gauge locos all live in boxes. The first one was made in 12mm ply and was almost as heavy as the loco (a LNER A1). In the box it was really a two man lift.

After that I built boxes in 6mm ply. The top and back are joined to the sides by screwing and gluing to 1" x 1" pse timbers and the bottom has a 2 x 1 each side again screwed and glued which not only join the bottom to the sides but provide wheel guides. Because the wheel flanges would dig in to the bottom plywood I placed a length of 20 gauge steel plate on the floor trapped under the edge of the 2 x 1s. These boxes have served now for 30 years on the smaller loco (a GNR Atlantic) and for 25 for my A4 which weighs in at almost 100lbs, and despite all the oil that accumulates in them and being hauled in and out of cars and being sat upon when lying about in steaming bays they are still quite serviceable, and certainly a lot lighter than if they were done in 12mm.

I'm sure this design will be adequate for wagon storage and transport.

My complements on your tanker. Looking forward to seeing it at Gilling.

Regards

Eddie

[Alan Wood]

Nice to see your taking care of your tanker , but how are you going to get it in the car ?

[Keith1500]

The box is up the back shed (woodworkshop) for varnishing. Never though to do a trial run. Still I guess I can always rivet an extension on the Mits !

More to the point, assuuming it fits - what room is left will dtermine the next wagon I guess. Now I was thinking GW Van or perhaps a GW bogie bolster. We'll see....

KB

[Keith1500]

A quick update come word of warning...

That water based varnish I used has a flaw. You may recall I used Vallejo - Acrylic gloss Varnish to complete the paint job on the tank. I opted for this as I felt the risk of ruining the transfers would be zero compared to using a spirit base varnish. Well, when exposed to sunlight it crazes.

I noticed patches at first on the top of the tank and slowly it has spread. It was pointed out at Gilling that sun light may be the cause. So I dug out the test piece and left it out in the sun and guess what? It’s started to craze. So what looked like a good product has let itself down on the last hurdle. Same.

Keith

[Richard Phillips]

eeek. I coated my transfers with a water-based varnish, then coated that with an automotive varnish.

[Keith1500]

How are they looking so far? ok i hope.

Mine was fine until it saw the sunshine. if you look close it looks like an old bathroom tile all crazed !!
ok from a distance thankfully.

[Richard Phillips]

I think I've got away with it... more luck than judgment on that one. No problem with the automotive varnish, just got to keep it off the transfers. The water-based varnish was a bit streaky by it's gloopy nature, I carefully rubbed it back a little, but sanding a see-through varnish without going through to the transfers is a bit on the tricky side. The finish is a little bumpy. The automotive varnish flowed out quite well if I remember.

How are they looking so far? ok i hope.

Mine was find until it saw the sunshine. if you look close it looks like an old bathroom tile all crazed !!
ok from a distance thankfully.

[Keith1500]

I am glad to hear your finish is holding up well, otherwise I can only suggest its night time running only !

I am two mind whether to dis-mount the tank and rub it down with a view of trying to apply a new layer of automotive varnish. If it goes wrong then I'll be back to re-lettering it which might have its bennefits!
Alternatively, I could just let it get realistically dirty by not cleaninging anymore!

[Richard Phillips]

The private owner liveries at the end of their lives did get dirty as this picture shows!

http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brmilk ... #h3aa0837f" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Keith1500]

Well Gilling is fast approaching and the "tile crazing" of the tanks finish is sad. So, upon someone telling me to try using meths on the water-based varnish with the possibility that it may soften it and lessen the harshness of the crack i thought i'd give it ago.




The one thing i didn't expect was to see the paint colour on the rag. So i am just not sure whats going on here but the meths has softened the finish and it would seem i am able to almost remove the "tile crazing" effect.

I am gently working a few square inches at a time. It feels a little like french polishing. You can feel the meths evaporating and the surface getting sticky.I either add a little bit more meths to work the surafce or withdraw leaving a uniform finish to the surface.

Then to bring it to finish I am using T cut followed by Mer polish. It looks better then before honest!

Keith

[Keith1500]

Paintwork was never a forte' of mine. Never been shown how to deal with issues etc and certainly not a nautral at it. So, not surprising I ended up with a few issues. The meths certainlt works and sofens paint and may be a good aid to correcting small faults. I played chicken and lost!

I had two patches which wouldnt go right and ended up with the under coat showing through. fortunately this was on top away from the lettering, not that this was to matter ....



However having decided to remove the tank from the chassis and lightly rub it down with some 1200 wet n dry to remove the varnish. Sadly, I managed to damage some letters. The damaged letters were removed with rubbing compound. The top was masked off and resprayed.



Here the lettering has been replaced and varnished in place with Ronseal satin water based varnish.
I am letting the paint dry for 24 hours or more before using rubbing compound to blend it in with original.



I might leave giving it a coat of lacquer until after Gilling. That should give the new paint plenty of time to release its solvents. I think this is where i went wrong originally? perhaps??

http://www.flickr.com/photos/38139616@N ... 181964232/

[Dave Noble]

"I might leave giving it a coat of lacquer until after Gilling."

I'm pretty sure that the word laquer implies that it is cellulose (or similar) based. That will certainly make a mess of your paintwork.

[Keith1500]

Well, in theory no. I say that because I have used all Halfords products so far. I used their undercoat both primer and primer build. their top coat and now finally their lacquer which it say is suitable with lots of things and therefore must be ok with their own top coat. If anything I would expect a problem with the lacquer and the Ronseal water base varnish used for the lettering.

Here is the tank todate. I got up at 5:15 this morning it before I went to work,to apply the lacquer coats (three in the end with 15mins drying time in between each) That gives it two day drying before I handle it back on to the chassis. ...and Halfords recommend 24hours for the top coat. I afforded it two days.



Never-the-less there are a few patches I am not happy with and if the sun light causes issues again i can only but start again but this time only using tins made up by a paint specialist. Though I have to say Halfords paint seem to have a good name. We'll see.

[Keith1500]

The Milk Tank is ready for the weekend at Gilling.



During the course of checking over the chassis I notice two missing nuts from the spring hangers!
I found three loose nuts on the buffer stocks. I oiled the screw couplings, wheels brake linkages etc for good measure and check my other three wagons. Worth doing I'd say. check your stock just in case.

Keith

[Richard Phillips]

The Milk Tank is ready for the weekend at Gilling.
During the course of checking over the chassis I notice two missing nuts from the spring hangers!
I found three loose nuts on the buffer stocks. I oiled the screw couplings, wheels brake linkages etc for good measure and check my other three wagons. Worth doing I'd say. check your stock just in case.
Keith

Yes, one of my wagons must have buffer locked at some point and bent the gear. Probably because two of the buffer shafts became rusty and welded the washers on the shaft making them solid with no compression. Worthwhile checking the drawgear and oiling/greasing the bits that need it. I've also has a split pin sheer on a buffer shaft and held in only by good luck. Maybe I should make up some wagon tickets after inspection for those that need remedial work!