Club marshalling yard design hints

[Richard Phillips]

In my local club some of the GL5 members have been promoting the activities of the GL5 (MLA) and as such there seems to be a general willingness to put in some sidings. On talking to the club chairman I was asked if I would like to submit a design outline.

Now, obviously the design will depend on the space available and I haven't measured it out, but a good amount of space is available, I estimate width for about 4 or five roads and over 7 coach lengths, probably more.

The line is a single line, dual gauge ground level 7.25", 5". What would be the ideal? Obviously dual track with a second yard would be desirable, but working on a start how should I/we go about this as it has the potential to open this track up to GL5 activities? A yard would need a head-shut/reception siding... but what else?

Note that the track is signalled with a mixture of semaphore and colour lights with pneumatic points and electronic detection.

[Ballan Baker]

Hi Richard, sounds good to me. Try to get a loop as well as a departure and arrival road. with the head shunt longer than the longest road if possible. By what you say, two yards ate possible,is that so/.
Regards Ballan

[Richard Phillips]

I never thought about a loop. I would think though, based on the limitations of the lever frame in the signal box we'd only be able to get one point off the main line, but that doesn't stop there being a loop in the yard. There's certainly enough room on site for a second yard somewhere, but I imagine any thoughts of that would be based on the success of this venture, which is why I think it's important to get right at the planning stage. Next step I imagine is to get out there with a tape measure!

The line is on a downhill section with a slight embankment, I think the yard will have a slight downhill roll (away from the buffers) but could be leveled, especially if the reception siding is taken further down where the embankment levels off. I would imagine one feature required would be a water tower of some sort and 'box to yard communication.

[Richard Phillips]

Anyone have any views on what the road spacing should be? Ideal turnout curvature? Buffer height I guess would be as-per GL5 standards if this is to be an exclusive 5" yard.

Also, does anyone have any idea how long a scale 14 coach train actually is? I suspect this will inform the ideal maximum length of siding?

[Eddyg]

Richard,

Spacing of sidings around 2'6". depending on how big your feet are for walking in between, but the dimensions and layout of the turnouts may ultimately dictate the spacing.

A 14 coach train of Mk 1s will be close to 80 feet in length but you need to consider the locomotive as well. A pacific will add nearly 7 feet and perhaps another 3 or 4 feet for a driving car, and you need to add for clearance from the next road i.e the train needs to be sufficiently far away from the turnout to allow another train to access the adjacent road, so you should allow for sidings of 95 to 100 feet.

For 5" gauge the recommended radius of track curvature is 35 feet (Martin Evans) although I know one track where it is less than 30 feet and 5" pacifics can just manage. Gauge widening helps to achieve this. For points you need to keep to as big a radius as possible. 45 feet gives a turnout about 6'6" long from the tip of the blades to the point of the frog.

Hope you have a big field.

Regards

Eddie

[David Hale]

Further to Richard's request for advice in designing a marshalling yard at our club site in Somerset, can anyone advise as to the best arrangement for sidings to ensure that operations can be carried out easily. For instance, rather than having sidings equally spaced, although not entirely prototypical, is there an advantage in having them in pairs, with a wider walkway in between the pairs.
Any advice, further to that already given would be gatefully appreciated.
The area we are developing has now been cleared, levelled, and an initial layer of coarse hardcore has been laid. Hopefully,more will be delivered during this coming week. Once this has been rolled, we propose allowing it to settle for a while before further development is carried out.

David Hale

[Dave Noble]

Regarding the spacing of sidings in pairs, I don't think it would be a good idea, what do you do if you want to couple a wagon on the next track but one, reach over a train of vans and struggle, or step over TWO rows of wagons and turn round. I think that idea is courting disaster.

As Ballan mentioned, try to get a loop as well as a headshunt. The loop wants to be off the main line, if you only have one lever available that's not a problem, you can operate both ends of the loop at the same time. This allows trains to enter and leave quickly without holding up other traffic.

Make sure you can run from the headshunt directly into the sidings without using the loop. That way, shunting is not interrupted by arrivals and departures as it is in Erimus Yard at Gilling. It's a nuisance when shunting to have to stop when the signalman decides that there may be a train arriving, and have to wait until it is in the loop before continuing with the shunting.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

Dave Noble

[David Hale]

Dave,

Many thanks for your input. I suspected that laying tracks in pairs might present a problem, and welcome your other advice.

If any member of GL5 is passing close by our site at the Bath and West showground en-route to the south west, and would be prepared to drop in to view our proposed yard, we would welcome suggestions regarding the the possible layout. A couple of us have drawn up a series of possibilities for consideration, but we are obviously keen to avoid making mistakes which others may have experienced when developing their own tracks.

Thanks once again.

David Hale.

[Richard Phillips]

Here are some shots of the yard area to give people some idea of the area we're talking about.

ESSMEE proposed yard area

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Yard area

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[David Hale]

Marshalling yard update.

With the passenger carrying season behind us, here at the East Somerset Society, we are now getting into the Autumn/Winter works programme.
Having levelled the site of our proposed yard in May, followed by laying and rolling hardcore to form a sound base, we have now started on the layout itself. Unfortunately, due to the limitation of the site, turnouts within the yard will can be of only 24 feet radius, whilst those connecting to the loop, and to the existing dual gauge 7 1/4" - 5" track will be larger.
Having two other major projects in hand, our club Chairman has provided a small (very small) budget to enable the actual work on the yard to commence. This has already been earmarked for the first 100 metres of aluminium rail, plus plywood and screws for shuttering, leaving just enough for aggregate and cement to make a start.
Last Wednesday we began pegging out, and setting our levels, but soon discovered that beyond the yard the ground falls away more rapidly than first appeared to be the case. We think that we have overcome this problem by swapping the headshunt with the passing loop. On Saturday the first of the shuttering was screwed into place, and hopefully more will go down this coming Wednesday. As soon as a sufficient length has been completed, the laying of concrete will commence - weather permitting.
We envisage that the project will proceed slowly. I will endeavour to update progress as appropriate.

[David Hale]

Marshalling yard update

Further to my previous posting, the first concrete was laid on Saturday 20th November - only a short stretch, but it's a start.
Hopefully, shuttering for the next length will be completed tomorrow (Wednesday 24th) and more concrete can be laid on the 27th.

David Hale.

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[Richard Phillips]

Wonderful David!

I'm really pleased this is happening and slightly disappointed there aren't more GL5 members taking note of this development - we're crying out for facilities like this (especially down South). I've lost count of the number of discussions I've had at GL5 meetings that lamented the lack of siding facilities that we could use with the wealth of rolling stock now out there, as well as having fun rather than just going around in a loop. I only wish I could help out a bit more and it's difficult since I now live in Swindon rather than Frome.

Anyway, best of luck and thanks for all your hard work in pushing through this idea - I really should have been there to back it a bit more.

[David Hale]

Richard,

Thanks for your comments. At present there are only a few of us actively participating, but hopefully, as we make progress others will become involved. In addition, we are hopeful that it will encourage current members of GL5 who live within travelling distance of the Bath and West showground, or people who are just interested in 5" gauge, to pay us a visit, and maybe, become involved.
We are sorry that you have moved away, but trust that we have not seen the last of you.

David.

[Dave Noble]

I was pleased to see that you'd made a start on the yard, how is progress coming on, and do you have a track plan which you could put on the forum for us to see, please.

[David Hale]

Thanks for the enquiry Dave.

Shortly after my previous posting winter arrived! As a result it has been far too cold for the laying of concrete. Together with Dave Surgey and Chris Ede plus a couple of other helpers, our efforts have been directed towards building a large ticket office to stand on the new station currently being built and erected at the Bath and West Showground. As soon as we see a reasonable improvement in the weather we shall get back to the concreting.
Regarding a plan of our proposed yard, I'll see what can be done.

By the way, a date for the diary - April 30th plus May 1st and 2nd - The South West Engineering, Model Making and Hobbies Show at the Bath and West Showground, Shepton Mallet. Unfortunately this does clash with the GL5 event organised by Nigel Dickinson at his track near Bath. However, it might be a chance to pay a short visit our 5"/7 1/4" track at the showground to see what we have achieved.

David.

[David Hale]

We are back in business at last! With no frost forecast, we poured a further 20 metres of concrete on Wednesday 9th Feb.

Today, amongst other things we have removed the shuttering, and hope to re-set the shuttering for the next length of concrete this coming Wednesday.

Further updates to follow.

David.

[David Hale]

Hello again,

As can be seen from the accompanying pictures, we are making progress at the Bath and West showground.

The first picture, looking south from the buffer stop end of the yard, shows six strips of concrete. That on the extreme left will be extended to form the headshunt. The next will be our arrivals line which will connect some way down the existing 7 1/4"/5" main line, and the other four will be extended to form sidings coming off the arrivals line. There are to be three further sidings.
The second picture shows a number of concrete pillars that are being cast to support the headshunt as it will be constructed on ground that falls away rather too much to be built up. The item wrapped in a plastic sheet left of centre is another pillar awaiting removal from the mould.

David

Further updates to follow.

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[Richard Phillips]

Wonderful progress David! With the headshunt falling away and pillars, it makes me think of the possibility of coal drops for my hopper The pillars remind me of your track, will the arrangement be similar?

[David Hale]

Hello again Richard. When are we going to see you again at Shepton?

The pillars are indeed similar to those on my own track, although somewhat taller. You may recall that on my own track the adjacent stream is inclined to flood from time to time. The pillars there are to allow the water to enter and exit without causing lasting damage as would have been the case if an embankment had been built. At Shepton, the purpose is to keep the headshunt level because the ground falls away in this area,otherwise a small shunting loco might struggle to push a rake of wagons into the yard.

David.

[David Hale]

Apologies for the long delay in providing an update to the progress being made at ESSMEE. In between helping to run trains for public events throughout the season, we have been pushing on with the groundwork, and currently we are somewhat in advance of the point I anticipated reaching by the end of the year. The Bath and West of England Showground is host to different events most weekends, and during the course of the year we have had many enquiries from visitors as to what we were doing! In the past week we have had a major tidy up, and the site is beginning to look more like a marshalling yard, as can be seen from the photographs.

Whilst as with most groups finance is a problem, we are hoping to have at least part of the yard in use in the first quarter of 2012 in time for the South west Model Show which is due to take place at the showground in March. With that in mind, two turnouts have already been made, and with a number of us concentrating on the outdoor work, several other club members have been working inside making track panels. To date 18 x 4 metre lengths have been put together. It is anticipated that a start will be made on laying the track on the concrete when weather permits in the new year.

The pictures with this posting relate to the headshunt. As previously mentioned, because the land falls away from the yard, it has been necessary to build the headshunt on pillars. These were precast on site, positioned on concrete pads to spread the load, and then reinforced beams were cast in situ to link the pillars. At present, a 20 metre headshunt can be accommodated, but there is room to extend by a further 12 metres if the need arises.

Several further pictures follow to show the yard itself.

David.

Headshunt complete seen from the north west.

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Headshunt complete seen from the south west.

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Looking south along the headshunt.

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